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Sources: Lincoln Considering RWD Flagship Sedan

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#1 ·
Sources: Lincoln Considering RWD Flagship Sedan
Will Lincoln chase after the high-end of the luxury market?
www.FordInsideNews.com
October 7, 2011
By: Nick Saporito


Ford has made it very clear that the company has every intention of revitalizing the Lincoln brand, much like the revitalization the Ford brand has had over the last several years. With a new designer and its own development team, it sounds like new Lincoln product ideas are taking shape- including a possible flagship.

FIN has been able to confirm with two independent sources that Ford is considering the development of a Lincoln flagship sedan. Both sources state that the car under consideration would be rear-wheel drive and be the pinnacle of Ford’s technology prowess. One source suggested the car would reside on a heavily modified variant of the Mustang platform.

Ford Motor Company’s greatly improved financial health is said to have sparked the discussion of the potential Lincoln flagship, which would undoubtedly be a very costly future product program.

FIN’s sources stated that Ford wants Lincoln to have a competitor to the Lexus LS and Mercedes Benz S-Class, which is the segment that this new flagship would target. General Motors’ Cadillac brand is also working on a flagship rear-wheel drive sedan to chase after the German luxury marquees; a car that is said to have a price range that tops out in six-figures.

This news comes just as the fate of Ford of Australia's rear-wheel drive Falcon sedan is in question. Perhaps Ford will progress with plans for a global rear-wheel drive program?

At this point it’s tough to say if the Lincoln flagship will ever see the light of day, but if it does…don’t expect it until later this decade. By then Lincoln’s currently unclear direction will be far more visible.
 
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#29 ·
I like the idea and think that they probably always were going to do it but, just wanted to wait for the new Mustang chassis before building one. I also think that the main concern for Lincoln is getting the lower end of the luxury market set first before heading into deeper waters. (which is what they've said is their plan) It makes perfect sense to me to have a strong base before going all out on higher end models that don't support it yet. Hopefully that rwd car is the MKR! It's just crazy to me for them to NOT build it sense it's the most popular concept car they've had in almost a decade. I'd then do a coupe to be the Mark IX and one to go head to head with BMW 3 series. ;-)
 
#30 ·
imho there is or might be a bright side to Fomoco taking Lincoln's upgrade so slowly
IF they do follow thru with it (a big IF so far)
and that is
that Lincoln could become a much more well-rounded, fully-developed Luxury Brand than Cadillac has (imho) so far
I agree totally and feel that that's their plan. Cadillac really only has the CTS (even though it's in 3 body styles) to really be considered a good car. the rest are just so so.
 
#32 ·
...and they are following it up with the smaller RWD 3-series/ C-class sized ATS which has the potential to be a good (interesting) car.
which ^ if I remember my GM alphabet soup
Cadillack themselves said it wouldn't be class-leading
&
since I'm bashing GM
...Cadillac really only has the CTS (even though it's in 3 body styles) to really be considered a good car. the rest are just so so.
I want to repeat my opinion that
the CTS is the best PONTIAC ever built
&
since I'm repeating myself
So it is only be considered. So if they decided to build it soonest we could see the car is in about 4-5 years .:rolleyes:
...
Mr. M. said some years ago that they could bring out RWD within 2 years from the greenlight - and Fomoco's greenlight ain't visible from my window so it could have been turned on a while back already!

I like the idea and think that they probably always were going to do it but, just wanted to wait for the new Mustang chassis before building one. I also think that the main concern for Lincoln is getting the lower end of the luxury market set first before heading into deeper waters. (which is what they've said is their plan) It makes perfect sense to me to have a strong base before going all out on higher end models...
...I'd then do a coupe to be the Mark IX and one to go head to head with BMW 3 series. ;-)
I'm not quite willing to attribute to the "F-Awd PHASE" we're in to wanting that as a first choice ... more like a LEMONADE situation
&
I have diff ideas of a name for the Mustang Co-Platformed Lincolns...
- MARK never applied to anything that small
- would it be "Mark" or "MK"?
- would it be "IX" or "9"?
- would make sense to start over with the numbers?
imho the best of those would be "MK1" and frankly don't think that's good enuf
 
#33 ·
As i see it Cadillac has better chance to compete against German luxurie in near future than Lincoln has. It has / will have competitior in 3 major classes (at least here in Europe, trucks and SUV doesn't play big role here)- ATS (3,C, A4), CTS (E,A6,5) and if all goes well they will have competitor against S class to.
Lincoln has MKZ which is basically upscale version of mondeo (or fusion if i've understood correctly) with upscale interior-for now (i doubt it rides better than 3 class, Mondeo sure doesn't) but who knows maybe in near future MKZ will be more different than Mondeo or fusion, MKS which compete against what again? S class or E class? It can't compete against both. And maybe there will be RWD flagship (i suppose it will go against S class so does that means MKS goes against E class)
Not to mention Cadillac has V department to go against AMG, M and RS and Lincoln has what ? I really would like to see Mustang based Lincoln 3 series competitior, or maybe flagship based on falcon platform with coyote in it ...but i'm not sure Ford has such vehicles in plans in near future.
 
#34 ·
^ asrapid,
imho Cadillac can SEEM ahead depending on how we make our List
( product that isn't here yet for example :toetap: )
but
as I mentioned, it perplexes me when their own execs say something yet-to-come won't be class leading ... so I don't see how they will be seriously "competing"
+
Audi is German too &-imho we can't say Lincoln isn't targeting their traits already
(btw the MKS's overall length is practically identical to the Audi A8-L's)

...compete against what again? S class or E class? It can't compete against both...
interestingly, an E/S-class-in-betweener is exactly the size I propose for a Rwd Lincoln Continental global flagship
imho the E/S & 5/7 models are out-of-date bifurcations of a "largest practical Lux sedan" & MB and BMW would combine them if they could get away with it - BMW kinda HAS!, by making their 5 & 7 share a platform now...much to the displeasure of some 5er enthusiasts -or- WouldBE 5er enthusiasts on forums

Lastly,
imho it might turn out that Cadillac's V-series is a TRAP
compromising Lux with performance that imho tries too hard...
...hard to do 'Lux/EFFORTLESS' when they're carried away trying to "Build Excitement"
cough*pontiac*cough
 
#35 ·
imho it might turn out that Cadillac's V-series is a TRAP
compromising Lux with performance that imho tries too hard...
...hard to do 'Lux/EFFORTLESS' when they're carried away trying to "Build Excitement"
cough*pontiac*cough
I'm a Ford fan, but the CTS is really more convincing as a true entry level Luxury car, its not a rebadged or rebodied Buick or Chevy and it does not ride on the Pontiac G8's (Holden) GM Zeta platform.
The CTS's more expensive Sigma II platform may now share some components with the Zeta, but they are not really identical, the Sigma platform uses more aluminum components and has a double A-arm front suspension instead of the McPherson strut suspension of the Zeta (Pontiac G8, Holden Commodore, Camaro etc)

Pontiac G8


CTS


Even the rear suspension is different (different geometry and the CTS has more aluminum components)
Pontiac G8


CTS


To me the CTS is probably one of the best modern GM cars.
Not impressed with the upcoming XTS though, its just a rebodied, upgraded FWD/AWD Buick LaCrosse, but the upcoming compact RWD ATS seems interesting.
 
#36 ·
^ thanks for the great pix, AM222


&
I'm a Ford fan, but the CTS is really more convincing as a true entry level Luxury car...
I thought that ^ too ... until I saw the CTS Coupe in person
its exterior came across soooo "plastic-fantastic" imho (like the over-cladded Pontiacs used to)
that I felt it was like someone screaming "FLASHY" at me - not a Luxury experience at all
(plus a rear seat about as UN-useable as the Mustang's -for adults- not sure which is worse, might be the CTS Coupe's ... and these are Not small cars!)
 
#37 ·
^ thanks for the great pix, AM222


&
I thought that ^ too ... until I saw the CTS Coupe in person
its exterior came across soooo "plastic-fantastic" imho (like the over-cladded Pontiacs used to)
that I felt it was like someone screaming "FLASHY" at me - not a Luxury experience at all
(plus a rear seat about as UN-useable as the Mustang's -for adults- not sure which is worse, might be the CTS Coupe's ... and these are Not small cars!)
I'm not a fan of the CTS Coupe, but plastic-fantastic?


The CTS i'm impressed with is the sedan.


My only problem with the $34K - $36K MKZ is, well it resembles the $19,850 Ford Fusion, while the $35K CTS doesn't resemble the Chevy Malibu, they aren't even related.
 
#38 ·
I'm not a fan of the CTS Coupe, but plastic-fantastic?


The CTS i'm impressed with is the sedan.


My only problem with the $34K - $36K MKZ is, well it resembles the $19,850 Ford Fusion, while the $35K CTS doesn't resemble the Chevy Malibu, they aren't even related.
My biggest gripe is that it does not offer a power tilt and telescope steering column or have rear HVAC vents. My 04 LS has all of those things, and they even offered rear heated seats in the LS which the MKZ does not even offer. That is unacceptable. The MKZ should have had these things from launch. Not saying it would have helped with sales but it would have helped differentiate it from the Fusion more.
 
#39 ·
via "KEEP FORD Falcon RWD and Export It to North America" on Facebook...

Lincoln RWD flagship rumors resurface - LeftlaneNews
By Drew Johnson Tuesday, Oct 18th, 2011 @ 6:40 pm

Lincoln’s long-rumored rear-wheel drive flagship is back in the headlines. The latest report involving the Lincoln range-topper suggests the sedan will be part of the brand’s ambitious plan to take on the likes of Mercedes-Benz and Lexus.

According to “two independent sources”, Lincoln is seriously considering the development of a new rear-wheel drive sedan that would rival vehicles like the Mercedes-Benz S-Class and Lexus LS. Such a project has been kicked around at Ford before, but the automaker’s improved financial outlook has reportedly given the project new legs.

Although we’d welcome such a project with open arms, we’re taking the latest report with a grain of salt. Ford Inside News describes the rear-wheel drive Lincoln as the “pinnacle of Ford’s technology prowess”, but then suggests the sedan could be based off the Mustang’s platform. While the Mustang certainly is an excellent car in its own right, we’d hardly call its live rear axle the “pinnacle of Ford’s technology prowess”.

If Lincoln’s rear-wheel drive initiative ever does come to fruition, it won’t likely be until the end of the decade.
 
#40 ·
via "KEEP FORD Falcon RWD and Export It to North America" on Facebook...

Lincoln RWD flagship rumors resurface - LeftlaneNews
By Drew Johnson Tuesday, Oct 18th, 2011 @ 6:40 pm

Lincoln’s long-rumored rear-wheel drive flagship is back in the headlines. The latest report involving the Lincoln range-topper suggests the sedan will be part of the brand’s ambitious plan to take on the likes of Mercedes-Benz and Lexus.

According to “two independent sources”, Lincoln is seriously considering the development of a new rear-wheel drive sedan that would rival vehicles like the Mercedes-Benz S-Class and Lexus LS. Such a project has been kicked around at Ford before, but the automaker’s improved financial outlook has reportedly given the project new legs.

Although we’d welcome such a project with open arms, we’re taking the latest report with a grain of salt. Ford Inside News describes the rear-wheel drive Lincoln as the “pinnacle of Ford’s technology prowess”, but then suggests the sedan could be based off the Mustang’s platform. While the Mustang certainly is an excellent car in its own right, we’d hardly call its live rear axle the “pinnacle of Ford’s technology prowess”.

If Lincoln’s rear-wheel drive initiative ever does come to fruition, it won’t likely be until the end of the decade.
I really do hope this is true, if it does use the Mustang platform they should be able to make at LEAST 2 versions a longer one and a shorter one
 
#41 ·
I really do hope this is true, if it does use the Mustang platform they should be able to make at LEAST 2 versions a longer one and a shorter one
Possibilities...
Maybe they'll have 3 wheelbase lengths, a shortened one for the Mustang, a standard one for the Falcon and a lengthened one for the Lincoln. (something like the Nissan 370Z, Infiniti G and Infiniti M)

With the Lincoln being a luxury car, I wouldn't be surprised if they gave the Lincoln version aluminum suspension components.
 
#42 ·
Let's face it guys. Lincoln has lost it's MOJO and it doesn't have a guess where to start looking. It amazes me that the employees that were going to see all of the future Lincoln's didn't come to be AND no one is calling the Company out for it. They know that we are not going to go for the smoke and mirrors. I don't know. Judging by the way some of you are holding on to every word in the rumor mill.....you just might. We will never be able to compete against Lexus. We have a totally different business model. Domestic cars are all about volume. You can't find a Lincoln with folding mirrors, because Ford doesn't have them on their products. No power closing doors. Should I go on?? We are great at volume driven products. The Focus, Explorer, Fiesta.....outstanding products. I say that we need to get out of the game until we are serious about luxury and spend the money making the best Ford cars on the planet. What say ye?
 
#43 ·
Let's face it guys. Lincoln has lost it's MOJO and it doesn't have a guess where to start looking. It amazes me that the employees that were going to see all of the future Lincoln's didn't come to be AND no one is calling the Company out for it. They know that we are not going to go for the smoke and mirrors. I don't know. Judging by the way some of you are holding on to every word in the rumor mill.....you just might. We will never be able to compete against Lexus. We have a totally different business model. Domestic cars are all about volume. You can't find a Lincoln with folding mirrors, because Ford doesn't have them on their products. No power closing doors. Should I go on?? We are great at volume driven products. The Focus, Explorer, Fiesta.....outstanding products. I say that we need to get out of the game until we are serious about luxury and spend the money making the best Ford cars on the planet. What say ye?
What the **** are you rambling on about? Just becuase Lincoln is missing power closing doors they should close the brand down?

Look at this, 10 years ago Lincoln was the best selling luxury brand in the USA. It is all about product right now and they are working on fixing their product and making them more different than their Ford counterpart. They had this 10 years ago wtih just 4 models in the lineup (Town Car, LS, Continential, Navigator)

Ford has the ability now that the PAG is gone, remember it is just Ford and Lincoln now, there is no one else.

Folding mirrors? I went on Lincoln's website adn all the models look like they have folding mirror except the MKZ so I am not sure where you got that as well.
 
#44 ·
Let's face it guys. Lincoln has lost it's MOJO and it doesn't have a guess where to start looking. It amazes me that the employees that were going to see all of the future Lincoln's didn't come to be AND no one is calling the Company out for it. They know that we are not going to go for the smoke and mirrors. I don't know. Judging by the way some of you are holding on to every word in the rumor mill.....you just might. We will never be able to compete against Lexus. We have a totally different business model. Domestic cars are all about volume. You can't find a Lincoln with folding mirrors, because Ford doesn't have them on their products. No power closing doors. Should I go on?? We are great at volume driven products. The Focus, Explorer, Fiesta.....outstanding products. I say that we need to get out of the game until we are serious about luxury and spend the money making the best Ford cars on the planet. What say ye?
Imho nothing is (YET) guaranteed about Fomoco's seriousness in making Lincoln a success

&
crossreference:
Seriously...With Audi stepping it up, and even Hyundai and Chrysler bringing noteworthy competition...Lincoln is falling further behind.
Acura, Volvo, Infiniti, Caddilac, and Lexus are all looking to tweak their images and play hard ball in the next few years, and even a solid entry by Lincoln could be stranded on base if it is not supported by the rest of the lineup.

Ford had to know the intentions of the rest of the luxury market years ago, and if they seriously wanted Lincoln to be on a level playing field, they would have sent more money their way, and considered paying down a little less of the debt right away.
$1 Billion sounds like a lot, but when your competition has been spending big money, and will continue to do so, it will take more than that just to catch up.
For 2 years now, Lincoln has been touting it's renewal, and peope are expecting it. When MKT and MKS get released with a mild exterior refresh all these months later, people will disregard Lincoln's promise of renewal, and be even more critical and skeptical of the MKZ, when it finally arrives...at the same timeframe as the Fusion for that matter!
 
#45 ·
which ^ if I remember my GM alphabet soup
Cadillack themselves said it wouldn't be class-leading
&
since I'm bashing GMI want to repeat my opinion that
the CTS is the best PONTIAC ever built
&
since I'm repeating myself
Mr. M. said some years ago that they could bring out RWD within 2 years from the greenlight - and Fomoco's greenlight ain't visible from my window so it could have been turned on a while back already!


I'm not quite willing to attribute to the "F-Awd PHASE" we're in to wanting that as a first choice ... more like a LEMONADE situation
&
I have diff ideas of a name for the Mustang Co-Platformed Lincolns...
- MARK never applied to anything that small
- would it be "Mark" or "MK"?
- would it be "IX" or "9"?
- would make sense to start over with the numbers?
imho the best of those would be "MK1" and frankly don't think that's good enuf
Sorry for the long response but, here goes my two cents: :p :popcorn:

Well the Front-AWD application worked for Audi for a long time. They only changed it a little in 2009 when they redid the AWD on the A4 to become more rear wheel biased. Also, Ford has already said that the next all-new Mustang will get a new chassis with IRS. It should debut in about 2 years. That chassis could easily be expanded for the MKR (which, personally, is what I think the new flagship will be since it was based off of the current Mustang chassis). Peter Horbury at one time said that the reason they changed the pronunciation of MK (although with just the 2 letters was originally going to be pronounced "Mark") to "eem kay" was because the 'Mark' series was historically for their premiere/special/elite cars (I'm paraphrasing there). So, the next coupe would be Mark IX or X. Also, they always used Roman numerals on the nomenclature in progression. I think that they'd continue in that direction.
And, as you know, there's been talk of adding a performance series to Lincoln as well. And it would be very easy to do with the current engine choices that Ford currently has to choose from. :cool: The original 3.5 liter TwinForce engine in the MKR was rated at over 400 hp. So, the MKS could be easily Ecoboosted to be a performance series.
So, I think the MKZ will be the "tell all" as to whether or not Lincoln will be a true competitor in the luxury field, and from what I've seen so far, it seems like Ford is serious about doing just that. A billion dollars may not be as much money as it was before but, I think they mean business. That money goes "on top" of what Lincoln's budget already was albeit wasn't very much. :mad: With PAG gone :D and Allan Mullaly at the helm, I think that they're going to allow Lincoln to soar again even higher than it was before! :D I forget the director's name from Lincoln that talked about the fact that Ford was becoming more of a premium brand with all of the new technology, designs, higher quality materials, etc. He said that people were asking where was Lincoln going to go since this was happening. His response was that he felt people were selling Lincoln short on it's potential. He went on to say that what FoMoCo has in store for Lincoln will really surprise and surpass everybody's expectations. ;)
 
#46 ·
Sorry for the long response but, here goes my two cents: :p :popcorn:

Well the Front-AWD application worked for Audi for a long time. They only changed it a little in 2009 when they redid the AWD on the A4 to become more rear wheel biased. Also, Ford has already said that the next all-new Mustang will get a new chassis with IRS. It should debut in about 2 years. That chassis could easily be expanded for the MKR (which, personally, is what I think the new flagship will be since it was based off of the current Mustang chassis). Peter Horbury at one time said that the reason they changed the pronunciation of MK (although with just the 2 letters was originally going to be pronounced "Mark") to "eem kay" was because the 'Mark' series was historically for their premiere/special/elite cars (I'm paraphrasing there). So, the next coupe would be Mark IX or X. Also, they always used Roman numerals on the nomenclature in progression. I think that they'd continue in that direction.
And, as you know, there's been talk of adding a performance series to Lincoln as well. And it would be very easy to do with the current engine choices that Ford currently has to choose from. :cool: The original 3.5 liter TwinForce engine in the MKR was rated at over 400 hp. So, the MKS could be easily Ecoboosted to be a performance series.
So, I think the MKZ will be the "tell all" as to whether or not Lincoln will be a true competitor in the luxury field, and from what I've seen so far, it seems like Ford is serious about doing just that. A billion dollars may not be as much money as it was before but, I think they mean business. That money goes "on top" of what Lincoln's budget already was albeit wasn't very much. :mad: With PAG gone :D and Allan Mullaly at the helm, I think that they're going to allow Lincoln to soar again even higher than it was before! :D I forget the director's name from Lincoln that talked about the fact that Ford was becoming more of a premium brand with all of the new technology, designs, higher quality materials, etc. He said that people were asking where was Lincoln going to go since this was happening. His response was that he felt people were selling Lincoln short on it's potential. He went on to say that what FoMoCo has in store for Lincoln will really surprise and surpass everybody's expectations. ;)
I agree the Lincolns should go by Twin Force!
 
#47 ·
See Andrew, that's exactly what I hope that we DON'T do as a Company. We were great TEN YEARS ago! Wow. So was Blockbuster, Sears, Circuit City, Pontiac and Oldsmobile. Geez, your wife might even say you were. The world is too fluid and customers too fickle to rely on what we USED to be. That's the same mentality that has made the Japanese get snookered on their own game. The Koreans are going to eat their lunch. No model changes for Toyota, Lexus, Nissan or Honda. They alll thought that styling doesn't matter.

And while you are sulking, I was talking about POWER folding mirrors. And NO Sir, we don't have any.......
 
#50 ·
When you learn how to read, prove it. Find a OG for the Ford Explorer and show me power FOLDING mirrors.
Maybe you should learn how to read instead of bashing someone else

Straight from Ford's broschure on their website for the Explorer

"Body-color, power-folding, heated sideview mirrors with LED
turn signal indicators, security approach lamps and driver’s
side memory"

Also from Lincoln's website

-Power-folding, heated sideview mirrors with chrome caps, security approach lamps, integrated
turn signals, blind spot mirrors, memory and driver’s side auto-dimming feature
 
#51 ·
When you learn how to read, prove it.
Are you talking to yourself?:rolleyes:

Find a OG for the Ford Explorer and show me power FOLDING mirrors.
Well, there you go:

http://www.ford.com/suvs/explorer/trim/?trim=limited&showCategoryTab=viewAll

Appearance:

"Body-color mirrors, heated, memory, power fold with security approach lamps and turn signal indicators"

You might want to have a look at the new 2012 Explorer Brochure and check out the Limited Standard Features:

http://www.ford.com/services/assets/Brochure?make=Ford&model=Explorer&year=2012&postalCode=34638

"Body-color, power-folding, heated sideview mirrors with LED
turn signal indicators, security approach lamps and driver’s
side memory."
 
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