Is this what a LincStang will compete with? - Page 2 - Ford Inside News Community
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post #11 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 01:09 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloggin View Post
...I would think if Lincoln offered a 3 series competitor with an extended Mustang wheelbase at 110/111 inches, there would also need to be a Ford performance model to justify it. But with the MKZ with a 112 inch wheelbase, that might be what becomes as close to a 3-series competitor that Lincoln would do.

[img http://www.2016fordfuturecars2017.co...ybrid-side.jpg /img]
[img http://new2016cars.net/wp-content/up...Class-side.jpg /img]

[img http://images.dealer.com/ddc/vehicle...-640-en_US.jpg /img]...
thing is
a FWD-based 112" wlb allows MUCH more interior room = bigger car
than a RWD with same/close wlb (see how short overhangs are on the 3er-types) &
Look at the '''prestige gap''' of 'wasted' space on the C-clash
WHICH gives 50/50 balance INSTEAD of interior room.
So
Z & LincStang with similar wlbs are Not similar otherwise

&
how many seats does an SL have?
quick-googling dimensions tells me only 2 real ones


Quote:
Originally Posted by nruggiero View Post
If they do a coupe, it needs to be a true full-size Continental Mark that's based on whatever the Continental sedan is based on (don't feel like getting into the 'D6' or 'CD6' rumors). In Lincoln's case, there's no sense in making specialty vehicles like coupes in several different sizes. Coupes just don't sell like they used to. It would be better to have one excellent specialty coupe with a really great heritage.
Mark Series is about...
...Z, X, and C
sorry, N.R,
I need a decade or so change my recent perception of MK

some years ago (on BON) we talked about 2 cars built off (whatever) Continental platform,
one more formal, one more swoopy
(in the Mission too)
But
they-then & I mho think something sorta CLS (or now Panamera) would sell much better than a large 2-door
+
there IS one 2-door already waiting in the partsbin which isn't going away...
...so a large one for Lincoln means double expense

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post #12 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 01:18 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

btw,
my smaller S550L LincStang with its precious prestige-gap, fantastic balance, and less-than-Z backseat room (tho More usable than any MusStang's)
would base-price HIGHER
(in Mission or LincStang the Beginning,
except for a base hybrid-p-i, iirc they start at $50k)

edit
check out some number crunching Paul8488 did
to get an idea of the price-premiums Lincolns are getting

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post #13 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 01:21 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

Great post. I've long been in favor of a 4-door LincStang but it seems a little late in the platform cycle now. The inability to option AWD on the current platform will depress sales among those who feel they need it but a RWD/AWD Lincoln in the current and upcoming design language would be sweet indeed. Ford has to know that the days of engineering an exclusive chassis for one car model is over.

Also, there's nothing that suggests that a small aftermarket culture that can satisfy the performance/appearance crowd couldn't surface around Lincoln. More Alpina or Brabus than SVO, AMG, M. Wider wheels, lower ground clearance, flared fenders and spoilers/splitters would be a welcome sight on a nicely proportioned RWD Lincoln-of-the-future. I can even see the MKC and MKX benefitting from performance/appearance mods right now. They wouldn't be your grandfather's Lincolns.

One can only hope that there is a small unofficial skunk-works at Lincoln secretly devising ways to encourage and support aftermarket entrepreneurs.
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post #14 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 02:17 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

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Originally Posted by Bloggin View Post
My expectation is that Ford engineering will find a way to remedy this. I remember early at the new Mustang launch, that Ford stated that the 'new' platform that the New Mustang rides on can be used for other applications. And a Lincoln coupe could also be where Lincoln more appropriately brings performance to Lincoln.
Having an AWD Lincoln would be a great differentiator from the RWD Mustang. If they're going to do a Lincstang, I'd want to see Mustang stay RWD-only.
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post #15 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 06:50 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

Lincoln will come with an elegant Mark, not with a 'stang.
The aftermarket will offer an 'upgrade to vs the Jaguars'.
Lincoln's place has been stamped as non-competitive in
top speed - it will be fast
acceleration - it will be quick
ride - it will corner AND be comfortable
silence - the golden will be delivered
Capris through Mexico - not this time.
(IMHO)
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post #16 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 08:44 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

I don't see a LincStang happening. I don't see any Lincoln coupe in the near future.

What I would like to see is the next generation Mustang platform become much lighter and slightly smaller, and a new Thunderbird from a stretched version of that platform (be it a coupe or 4-door).

"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."
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post #17 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 11:54 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

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Originally Posted by Logans Run View Post
I don't see a LincStang happening. I don't see any Lincoln coupe in the near future.

What I would like to see is the next generation Mustang platform become much lighter and slightly smaller, and a new Thunderbird from a stretched version of that platform (be it a coupe or 4-door).
GM's Alpha platform is celebrated for it's class leading weight so given the Camaro SS is less than 50lbs lighter than the Mustang GT I wonder just how much weight could really be shaved? The structure has to be stiff, and it has to meet crash regulations, without going to more exotic, expensive materials I'm thinking we're unlikely to see great reductions in weight. I was surprised to see the current Vette weights over 3500lbs so with the Mustang GT being a little over 200lbs heavier, made of steel and with it being a larger four seater how do you get much lower without raising the price out of pony car territory?

Again, Alpha is celebrated as being world class in terms of weight and structure and the Camaro SS is barely lighter than the GT, this is just the new normal I guess.
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post #18 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-19-2015, 12:16 PM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

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Originally Posted by SP1966 View Post
GM's Alpha platform is celebrated for it's class leading weight so given the Camaro SS is less than 50lbs lighter than the Mustang GT I wonder just how much weight could really be shaved? The structure has to be stiff, and it has to meet crash regulations, without going to more exotic, expensive materials I'm thinking we're unlikely to see great reductions in weight. I was surprised to see the current Vette weights over 3500lbs so with the Mustang GT being a little over 200lbs heavier, made of steel and with it being a larger four seater how do you get much lower without raising the price out of pony car territory?

Again, Alpha is celebrated as being world class in terms of weight and structure and the Camaro SS is barely lighter than the GT, this is just the new normal I guess.
The difference in advertised base manual weights (SS vs GT) is only 35lbs. That is far too small an amount given two different (albeit closely) sized vehicles to assess any supreme benefactors in terms of chassis advantages. I am certain given the large amount of CAE analysis for both structures, that they are both within spitting distance of each other in terms of results. And thus, any small differences in results rides nearly entirely on critical factors like suspension design and setup, driveline, powertrain, tires, tuning, gearing, track or weather conditions, driver input, etc.

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post #19 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-25-2015, 05:24 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SP1966 View Post
GM's Alpha platform is celebrated for it's class leading weight so given the Camaro SS is less than 50lbs lighter than the Mustang GT I wonder just how much weight could really be shaved? The structure has to be stiff, and it has to meet crash regulations, without going to more exotic, expensive materials I'm thinking we're unlikely to see great reductions in weight. I was surprised to see the current Vette weights over 3500lbs so with the Mustang GT being a little over 200lbs heavier, made of steel and with it being a larger four seater how do you get much lower without raising the price out of pony car territory?

Again, Alpha is celebrated as being world class in terms of weight and structure and the Camaro SS is barely lighter than the GT, this is just the new normal I guess.
While Gt Mustang and SS Camaro are close, it's the other variations that show up the difference
between the two more clearly, the 2.0T LT1 is 3345 lbs, approx 200 lbs lighter than Ecoboost
so I'm left thinking that that the 2.0T may beat Ecoboost The V6 Mustang is about 100 lbs
heavier and about 30 hp shy of the V6 Camaro, and nearly a second slower.
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post #20 of 29 (permalink) Old 10-25-2015, 08:01 AM
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Re: Is this what a LincStang will compete with?

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Originally Posted by jpd80 View Post
While Gt Mustang and SS Camaro are close, it's the other variations that show up the difference
between the two more clearly, the 2.0T LT1 is 3345 lbs, approx 200 lbs lighter than Ecoboost
so I'm left thinking that that the 2.0T may beat Ecoboost The V6 Mustang is about 100 lbs
heavier and about 30 hp shy of the V6 Camaro, and nearly a second slower.
I had to double check those numbers, and you are right on the I4 weights. Interesting. I mean, obviously it's not just engine weight that is the contributor, as the engines themselves are both essentially about the same size, aluminum, twin cam, single turbo, etc. So it must mostly be how they are packaged that makes up most of that weight, I think. I4 in Camaro is base, where Mustang is an upgrade. Or not. Mustang still undercuts it in price. I am curious how sales will pan out for both.

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