"Teslas are .... " - Page 32 - Ford Inside News Community
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post #311 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glyphics View Post
It seems to me that if Ford had such vast experience building EVs, they would have been able to meet the Tesla challenge within a very few years. Tesla's "popularity" has been a publicly known phenomenon since the introduction of the Model S in 2012. With over 200 mile range, the Model S has sold 119,000 by the end of 2017.

Here is Ford's vast experience:

Ford's Ranger EV (1998-2002) had a constant-speed range of 115 miles at 45 mph with the NiMH batteries; 87 miles with lead-acid. Ford sold about 1,500 mostly to fleets.

The Focus EV (2011-2018) has a nominal range of 115 miles. By the end of 2017, Ford sold about 9,000, mostly to fleets. Ford spent as little R&D on this vehicle as possible, buying the power train from Magna, a Canadian company, and gussying-up an already in-production model. It looked like, was marketed like and sold like nothing special.

No doubt, Ford is now feverishly developing its bevy of new EVs, as well they should. IMO, If Ford had developed this fever in 2012, employing its vast experience, Ford would have their answers to Tesla on the road RIGHT NOW.
...Ford crushed every single Ranger they made when they came back off-lease. Wouldn't let them hang around in the marketplace.

The Focus EV was for compliance only and looks like it. Have you seen the hatch on it? Not meant for mass-market and was zero effort. Ford killed off their Escape hybrid, which was very successful and replaced it with the CMax they couldn't give away. If you watched Ford from afar, it might appear they actually have no desire to be competitive with EVs or PHEVs.
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post #312 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 01:46 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

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Originally Posted by mooseman View Post
...Ford crushed every single Ranger they made when they came back off-lease. Wouldn't let them hang around in the marketplace.

The Focus EV was for compliance only and looks like it. Have you seen the hatch on it? Not meant for mass-market and was zero effort. Ford killed off their Escape hybrid, which was very successful and replaced it with the CMax they couldn't give away. If you watched Ford from afar, it might appear they actually have no desire to be competitive with EVs or PHEVs.
They went with C-Max vs. Escape hybrid in an effort to create some "Prius magic" of a unique hybrid model. I thought it was a mistake at the time to drop Escape hybrid (they could've simultaneously offered C-max too). C-Max was doing relatively well sales-wise until the two mileage decreases, which caused sales to cut in half to a trickle largely overnight.

At least they're fixing that with the new Escape.

I like how you completely ignore Fusion hybrid/PHEV which has been the most successful of them all....

Yeah, Ford wants nothing to do with EVs or PHEVs...*crash* *Aviator smashes through the wall*
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post #313 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 03:56 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

Ford at least offered a BEV product for nearly a decade, while nearly every other manufactured did not.
Ford at least offered hybrid SUV, CUV, sedan and luxury cars, when very few bothered with either.
Ford is also about to roll out their 3rd generation of PHEV’s, where many still offer none.
And we all know that Ford is on the cusp of sharing with the world what their next generation of BEV products and platforms will look like, for a long term strategy.


But none of that matters to some who can only see negativity through what they falsely believe is objective criticism.

It’s laughable and boorish.
Ford may make mistakes, but they are at least attempting to navigate what is uncertain waters.

Carry on.
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post #314 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 04:10 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

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...what excellence? Are they currently building any BEVs? No? Hmmm.
Excellence building cars... or Tesla build something else? A Mercedes-Benz car is a guarantee of excellence, whatever the power plant impulse that car (gasoline, diesel or electricity) . The EVs are new for M-B? Maybe. But the experience of this automaker in the auto business is not in doubt.

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post #315 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 04:48 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

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I don´t want to drive a car with 1 inch gaps between the body pieces, I don´t want to drive a car that cost 60000$ and have an extreme austere interior most related with a Chinese car than with a luxury car.
Got it. So your answer is no. You've never driven it. Sounds good! Second hand opinions. Your posts stink of extreme bias, an unwillingness to hear the opinions of others, and immovable arrogance. They don't, typically. I like you a lot. But your Tesla posts are consistently overly critical and imho, it sounds like you want nothing more than for the first NEW and MAJOR American car company to fail for no fcking reason. 1 inch gaps... Come on man, go actually look at one and drive one. If there were ever those issues they're really not around any more. But you probably don't even care.
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post #316 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 05:01 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

As for what Wings is saying, he is completely right. The tendency for users on this site to shite all over Ford for little to no reason while vehemently defending the often incompetent competition is entirely ridiculous.

However, imho his desire to maintain this site as accepting of political discussion and circle-jerking for the sake of "free speech" and "freedom of expression" contradicts his inability to accept people's tendencies to be enormously biased against Ford. Not sure what he wants to accomplish by crapping on the Ford haters, since they're just expressing their overly negative opinions on this bastion of free speech we call FIN. Nothing on this site is as hated as Tesla or Hackett though!

@wingsnut of course you know I support you in many ways, I'm just poking some fun about the politics stuff I think you're entirely right about the general anti-Ford vibe that came out of nowhere. Granted, I think it all started with Fields getting sacked. The axe finding it's way into the sedan lineup also did NOT help, along with an overall aging lineup. These frustrations will largely be quelled once the SUV lineup is freshened up and we see some more competitive EV products hit dealers. Aviator was a wrlcomed bit of awesome news, but people are ready for Explorer, Escape, Bronco, Maverick, F150 hybrid, Mustang hybrid, new MKC, MKZ replacement, etc...

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post #317 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 05:21 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

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Got it. So your answer is no. You've never driven it. Sounds good! Second hand opinions. Your posts stink of extreme bias, an unwillingness to hear the opinions of others, and immovable arrogance. They don't, typically. I like you a lot. But your Tesla posts are consistently overly critical and imho, it sounds like you want nothing more than for the first NEW and MAJOR American car company to fail for no fcking reason. 1 inch gaps... Come on man, go actually look at one and drive one. If there were ever those issues they're really not around any more. But you probably don't even care.
Someone in the Airpark where I work just got a dark gray Model 3, and just before Christmas I was behind him leaving and we waited through about 3 lights before we hit the main road. After all I have been hearing, I was amazed at how well put together that car looked. I am sure there have been some issues with panel gaps on some of the Model 3's, but not this one for sure!
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post #318 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-03-2019, 07:59 PM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

The sentiment, for most, is not anti-Ford. I don't believe that there are any great American auto manufacturers any more but I remain a Ford fan. Ford makes two desirable passenger vehicles and only one is truly world class; the F-150 (Well, OK, the Focus ST/RS is really hot but we're not going to get it.). Fortunately, F-150 can spawn a few sibling models (SUVs) while Mustang is not allowed to spawn anything. Pro-Ford or anti-Ford; this is not a great track record.

I have a hard time being optimistic about Ford management decisions, especially with William at the helm. I have high hopes for the new CD6 class of vehicles but the notion that a golden age is about to dawn on Ford stretches reason. If the "anti-Ford" posts sound over-the-top let's use the same standard for the "pro-Ford" posts.
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post #319 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-09-2019, 11:24 PM
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I have been a Ford fan all my life. However, they’ve given me little to look forward to over the last few years. But, they’re are doing well in their strengths. I just took my mom out to buy a new Expy Limited, and it is stellar. I simply wish Ford put the same kind of effort into where the world is headed. I actually think Ford is headed in the right direction, somewhat. BEV trucks won’t be a big thing for at least another cycle. But, they need to have something out that shows people they get it. I was always dismayed that Lincoln never made the Concept C. I thought that could really help Lincoln understand where luxury buyers are today. But, Ford has always been very conservative at addressing their shortcomings. The Aviator and Explorer look to build on the great Expy/Navigator. I hope they maintain the momentum.

That said, let’s get back on topic: Elon just announced the 75kwh S and X are dead and the line is moving to SR and LR models. I’m betting this coincides with the switch to 2170batteries and an increase in pack sizes. I’d wager we see 300 and 400mi range Model S, or somewhere around it.
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post #320 of 396 (permalink) Old 01-10-2019, 11:34 AM
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Re: "Teslas are .... "

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Originally Posted by gjrip View Post
@wingsnut of course you know I support you in many ways, I'm just poking some fun about the politics stuff I think you're entirely right about the general anti-Ford vibe that came out of nowhere. Granted, I think it all started with Fields getting sacked. The axe finding it's way into the sedan lineup also did NOT help, along with an overall aging lineup. These frustrations will largely be quelled once the SUV lineup is freshened up and we see some more competitive EV products hit dealers. Aviator was a wrlcomed bit of awesome news, but people are ready for Explorer, Escape, Bronco, Maverick, F150 hybrid, Mustang hybrid, new MKC, MKZ replacement, etc...
"I think it all started with Fields getting sacked. The axe finding it's way into the sedan lineup also did NOT help, along with an overall aging lineup."

That doesn't sound like nowhere. Also, you'd be surprised that there are a lot of people who like sedans, especially RWD sedans. Frustration indeed.

A close look at some posts from those who express negative vibes (like me), you will find that they also drop praise when it's due. I guess it's easier to remember what pisses you off (not you in particular), than it is to remember what floats your boat.
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