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Re: Ford Adding Hybrid F150, Mustang, Transit by 2020 in major EV push; expands US pl

Beat ya by 6 minutes ;)
Yes, I saw that; I knew something was up with it being at 11:00 and at Flat Rock.


Frump has little to nothing to do with this.

Awesome awesome awesome. It's about time Ford got on the ball with electrification. They're falling behind fast! But things like a hybrid F-150 and Mustang will put them towards the top yet again.
Sour grapes; of course he does, or are you giving the credit to Putin?


C'mon Ed get with it!
I was distracted the homer's over at GMI were all crying and wetting themselves..............
 

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We disagree on Ford's business motivations, but I'm gonna stop the politics here.

This is an AMAZING announcement and I can't wait to buy one of these products.
 

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By 2020, next gen EB engines that are uniquely built and optimized for hybrids will be available. Today’s hybrids use existing engines with little more than different cam profiles. We have found many ways to further optimize, especially through reduced friction. All combined, these next hybrids will be much more efficient. This is also why I have been pro hybrid instead of EV. And speaking of EV, I bet this new CUV includes AWD. Something currently lacking.
That's good to hear. I anticipated the EB engines making it's way to hybrid duty because of it's intelligence and vast programability to perform based on it's use. Ranging from much more power or more efficiency, and a blending of both. When I read about the 3-cylinder offering cylinder deactivation, I know something was up. Which meant that a 4 cylinder engine could do the same. Intelligent programming for more efficiency along with 'smart' cylinder deactivation should offer the max efficiency.

Which means that the Transit Connect Hybrid taxis that are roaming around a few cities now, are also testing the new EcoBoost Hybrid engine technology as well.

I think that all models sharing the new Focus platform should have e-AWD as an option at least. The Escape Hybrid has been gone for too long, which needs AWD as a CUV. e-AWD is what a next gen MKC needs as well.
 

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Wonder what happens to the partially built San Luis Potosi plant, and the supplier park development already underway. Plus all the transportation infrastructure that has been done.

Trumps tax breaks and new regulatory rules must be one heck of a sweet deal for Ford to make a decision to walk away from San Luis Potosi.

Also Ford will need to invest quite a chunk of change to add Focus assembly to the Hermosillo plant, being set up for CD size and not C size.

Plus Flat Rock will need a good chunk of change to add this new "small" EV SUV.

Like Fields said in his blurb that it is all about good business for the company, so the incentives from Trump have to be very special to make such a turn.

EDIT: Mexico regrets Ford's decision to cancel plans to build a plant in the central Mexican state of San Luis Potosi and has made sure that the company will reimburse the state for any costs associated with the investment, the government said on Tuesday.
 

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Wonder what happens to the partially built San Luis Potosi plant, and the supplier park development already underway. Plus all the transportation infrastructure that has been done.

Trumps tax breaks and new regulatory rules must be one heck of a sweet deal for Ford to make a decision to walk away from San Luis Potosi.

Also Ford will need to invest quite a chunk of change to add Focus assembly to the Hermosillo plant, being set up for CD size and not C size.

Plus Flat Rock will need a good chunk of change to add this new "small" EV SUV.

Like Fields said in his blurb that it is all about good business for the company, so the incentives from Trump have to be very special to make such a turn.

EDIT: Mexico regrets Ford's decision to cancel plans to build a plant in the central Mexican state of San Luis Potosi and has made sure that the company will reimburse the state for any costs associated with the investment, the government said on Tuesday.
Maybe they can sell it to GM?

Seriously dude, you act like they built all new roads for this one Ford Plant; not even close.....................

Ford can see which way the current is going, swim against it at your own risk..............
 

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Seriously dude, you act like they built all new roads for this one Ford Plant; not even close...................................
I realize that BMW is putting up shop in the same neighbourhood.

I am just trying to understand the decision, as the Focus still moving to Mexico has not changed. And the penalties associated with cancelling such a deal has to cost Ford a couple of bucks.

Like I said, the deal from Trump must be a dandy for Ford to be able to do what they planned to do anyway (minus a new factory), but just in a different part of Mexico.

Focus & Fusion coming from the Hermosillo Mx. plant to the USA won't piss off Trump?
What's going on?
 

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I realize that BMW is putting up shop in the same neighbourhood.

I am just trying to understand the decision, as the Focus still moving to Mexico has not changed. And the penalties associated with cancelling such a deal has to cost Ford a couple of bucks.

Like I said, the deal from Trump must be a dandy for Ford to be able to do what they planned to do anyway (minus a new factory), but just in a different part of Mexico.

Focus & Fusion coming from the Hermosillo Mx. plant to the USA won't piss off Trump?
What's going on?
If you start building a house, and after you've begun, you realize it is over a sink-hole; do you keep going, because it'll cost you money if you stop? (ignoring the fact it'll cost you even more later)

The Fusion comes from Mexico now, the Focus is still made in the US, and will be until something physically pushes it out.

You are not looking at the net-net; A plant is not being built in Mexico, a plant in the US is expanding, adding production and jobs.
 

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The extra stuff in the USA was going to happen anyway aka electrification etc, besides the planned Model E.

The Focus was and is still moving to Mexico.
Ford walks away from the new plant and its incentives from the Mexican government - Among the benefits granted to Ford was 280 hectares, the ten-year waiver of payroll tax, ten years of property tax, as well as facilitating everything related to construction licenses.

As I asked before "Focus & Fusion coming from the Hermosillo Mx. plant to the USA won't piss off Trump?"

That is the elephant in Trumps room right? USA cars being built in Mexico and coming across the border tax free to be sold in USA?

Why is Fields making an issue of him and Bill Ford calling the President elect and Vice President elect to tell them the news?
 

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I've read speculation elsewhere that the two police hybrid vehicles will be Explorer and Expedition. I really expect Ford to discontinue the Taurus and C-Max in North America.

Ford must expect sedan sales to decline for both Focus and Fusion to fit at Hermosillo. I believe jpd80 said elsewhere that the next Focus and Fiesta will share a platform that will not be shared with the Escape, but I wonder if the next North American Focus sedan and Fusion will share a platform, just as the Civic and next generation Accord will.
 

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If you start building a house, and after you've begun, you realize it is over a sink-hole; do you keep going, because it'll cost you money if you stop? (ignoring the fact it'll cost you even more later)

The Fusion comes from Mexico now, the Focus is still made in the US, and will be until something physically pushes it out.

You are not looking at the net-net; A plant is not being built in Mexico, a plant in the US is expanding, adding production and jobs.
As of 2017 ALL Fusion(some production was at Flat Rock until end of 2016) and MKZ are manufactured in Mexico and Focus and C-Max are moving to Mexico at the same plant. That plant will require major upgrades/expansion to be able to handle c-segment vehicles. No new plant, but major expansion of the current plant in Hermosillo. Expansion there should be close to a Billion.

Remember, there is also a new small/c-segment sedan coming for Lincoln, which should go to Hermosillo also

Expansion at Flat Rock for Mustang + Hybrid, Continental along with the expected New Taurus + Hybrid, and new EV and development center. That expansion is at $700 Million.

So I don't really see any additional benefit that the government can offer. This is just a more responsible business decision on Ford's part with their manufacturing and planning for the future. All production Ford wanted to move, is still moving and more already did under the radar. Construction is just happing at a different plant, not a new one, but construction happening and the dollars are still being spent.
 

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I've done a bit more reading on this now and I have to say I was wrong. The Michigan news actually has a lot to do with the pro-business Trump policies. Happy to see a positive change for Ford as a business because of them. I'm sorry that I jumped so quickly to assume this was going to be another one of the stories about Trump taking credit for jobs yadda yadda.

Good for Ford and good for America so it's good for me!
 

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I've read speculation elsewhere that the two police hybrid vehicles will be Explorer and Expedition. I really expect Ford to discontinue the Taurus and C-Max in North America.

Ford must expect sedan sales to decline for both Focus and Fusion to fit at Hermosillo. I believe jpd80 said elsewhere that the next Focus and Fiesta will share a platform that will not be shared with the Escape, but I wonder if the next North American Focus sedan and Fusion will share a platform, just as the Civic and next generation Accord will.
NG Explorer Hybrid and NG Expedition Hybrid do make sense for new police pursuit vehicles.

Taurus production is pushed out until 2023 from 2017, which is a whole new 6 year product lifecycle. That's why I expect the new Taurus to make it to NA as a MY2018 Taurus. The only other option is for Ford to continue to make the same outdated Taurus for 7 more years....which will never happen.

Hermosillo is working double shifts, 6 days a week to keep up with current Fusion/MKZ production. Focus Sedan, Focus Hatch, Focus ST, C-Max and the new Lincoln C-Segment vehicle will require extensive expansion investment. In the US alone, Fusion sales are down about 20k units to 246k as of Nov. MKZ are up at 28k. With all Fusion/MKZ production for US and Canada shifted to Hermosillo, their next option is to go three shifts just to keep up.

NG Fiesta is already set on it's new modified/upgraded b-Segment platform(not shared with c-segment Focus/Escape), with production for NA moving to Thailand.

Civic and NG Accord will share a heavily modified 'version' of the same platform, but not the same platform. Meaning they can't travel down the same production line.
 

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I think the reason that there is no Lincoln news mentioned in the release is that Ford is making a concerted effort to separate Lincoln and Ford as much as possible, as they did with removing the Ecoboost branding from vehicles, and that doesn't mean that Lincoln won't be receiving any of the hybrid tech. It's just further distancing the two brands in consumers and the media point of view.

With D6 coming on board with the ability to accept v8 engines (I think some forget that no Lincoln vehicle sans the Navi can even fit a V8), and the new hybrid tech, phase two for Lincoln should be exciting.
 

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Just thought of something. Typically with a Hybrid trunk space is used up for the batteries however Ford has been pretty cleaver about the packaging like with the current Fusion and MKZ. Wonder if there will still be enough room for a drop top.
 

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I'm frankly more interested in the direction of the new Focus than any of these electric cars. I hope for a roomier, more simply styled car than the current model with a regular automatic transmission. If it were up to me, I would built the sedan in Mexico and import the hatchbacks from Germany.
 

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with the aluminum ExpedNavi it does *sound* good for electrolisis
but
just got a feeling the 2nd LeO vehicle will be closer to a Model-E
( which iir(ead)c is now going to be a Cuv )
A pursuit rated new Taurus would be more on par with the current Charger size wise, and rear/perp seating.

Then again there is the Mustang. Several countries including the UK are testing, have tested and are using the stock car with additions as a high speed pursuit vehicle. The Mustang failed the Australian police dept. test because of an overheating transmission. Which would be resolved with a new duty designed unit for 2018.

 

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The extra stuff in the USA was going to happen anyway aka electrification etc, besides the planned Model E.

The Focus was and is still moving to Mexico.
Ford walks away from the new plant and its incentives from the Mexican government - Among the benefits granted to Ford was 280 hectares, the ten-year waiver of payroll tax, ten years of property tax, as well as facilitating everything related to construction licenses.

As I asked before "Focus & Fusion coming from the Hermosillo Mx. plant to the USA won't piss off Trump?"

That is the elephant in Trumps room right? USA cars being built in Mexico and coming across the border tax free to be sold in USA?

Why is Fields making an issue of him and Bill Ford calling the President elect and Vice President elect to tell them the news?
The Focus was going to San Luis Potosí, Mexico - Today that plant officially became vaporware, now Focus goes to either Hermosillo or Cuautitlán, Ford will build whatever else they have room to build, but what they can't comes back to the US.

Flat Rock is getting major investment and growing, the shift in growth is towards US, not Mexico.


I've done a bit more reading on this now and I have to say I was wrong. The Michigan news actually has a lot to do with the pro-business Trump policies. Happy to see a positive change for Ford as a business because of them. I'm sorry that I jumped so quickly to assume this was going to be another one of the stories about Trump taking credit for jobs yadda yadda.

Good for Ford and good for America so it's good for me!
:thumb: Glad you came to your senses!...............
 
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