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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
posting in the Mercury Section instead of the Design Center since I don't anticipate doing believable 2020 chops in the near future
Mission2020: The RETURN of MERCURY!

as a boutique Brand of small(er) Luxury vehicles that imho the Lincoln name cannot effectively offer,
fulfilling the Small Mercs Theorem as the *FUN* side of Lincoln:

* not positive about metaSport since it's relatively larger than "small" ... altho there's a possible RANGER tie-in
** all 'saloons' (& possibly coupe-hatches) have a dual-back structure: a hatch with a separate inset trunklid (see Skoda Superb)

• Ideally all Mercury models are about the width of the next size category up in Ford vehicles...like the MKC Concept is significantly wider than the Escape.
• All drivetrains for Lincoln-Mercury vehicles will be electrically assisted to various degrees
initially: 1.0EB3, 1.5EB3*, & 2.0EB4 (all gen2) as "M"(pg) light-hybrids (44-66kW);
and "R" sporty models, with approx. 22-44 kW depending on size & role.
Micro & microSport = 160hp,.------225hp
Micro & -----------& 230-250hp,..280-300hp
for the rest
* see revised drivetrains' graphic below... NO! see newer,RErevised GRAPHIC HERE

followed by
"H", full-hybrid versions utilizing Atkinson-mode + more electrics...
(small models have less battery space & support lower total HP even with same petrol engine. see Cortina/miniSport & Milan/metaSport, or C3/Milan)

And
a couple high-performance models adding the 2.3EB4*("R23") and 2.7EB6**("XR") but with less electrification (batteries &or capacitors), just enough for anti-slip & 'JATO'
-------C3--------------- 325hp*
-------C5---------------.400hp**

** wonder if the C5-XR could be RWD (+ front electrics)?
actually, if FLincMoCo does the CD4+rwd for the Continental, imho they could be capable of Rwd'ing JUST the XR - related chassis afterall. Then again... maybe the 2.0EB "R" with 290hp ought to be RWD too? ...plus
Would it be good/remarkable to offer a RWD "H" hybrid even though it only has 220hp?
Could the C5 be called (dare I say it...) "COUGAR"?
Would it make a difference if all C5's are RWD?
And
should the C3 be called "Capri" whether C5 gets a Name or not? ...btw, 325hp IS a lot for the basically FWD Capri but some of that is rear-wheel electrics & thinking they could be programmed to help control torque-steering.


revised drivetrains:

note:
Malibu Eco has ~20hp(15kW) electrics, 2007 Mariner/Escape had 22hp,
C-Max/Fusion/MKZ Hybrids have 118hp(88kW), Volt has 149hp(111kW)
&
a new type of hybrid electric add-on from the University of Tennessee
REVISED mission statement:
to exploit pricepoints, segments, and demographics less-consistent with Lincoln's goals & heritage
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
Many of these models we may never otherwise get in N.A.
No matter how often "forum-favorite" variants are ranted for
Models too small, sporty or 'casually adventurous' for Lincoln
With an Oval badge they'd over-crowd the Ford lineup anyway
so
Mercury's "heritage" of leftovers & hand-me-downs is taken to a global level:


Comments are extra welcome! Think I really need help/input with pricing...
...for features at a pricepoint & vice versa!

Since all drivetrains are variously electrified, there is no price difference between the lowest-powered, greenest full Hybrids and the less-electrified, turbo-powered "M" drivetrains; but there are moderate price increases for each step up of the sport models.

Features/Options/Packages are *identical* on every type of model, producing a uniform +$5500 MSRP spread from each base vehicle to its fully loaded version.
another unintended benefit of this compressed price range could be that Mercury would more easily fit between Ford and Lincoln
Here's what's included in the experimental 'trim' levels ... collapsed into just 2 packages & 2 options (though electronic gizmos that can be made snap'n'lock dealer-installable could alter this plan)(edit: since all these Mercurys are hybrids, they can all have 110V outlets, right? ... center console & a flippable one in the rearseat armrest/passthru to trunk).

standard features:
• 'R', 'R23', and 'XR' models include Active Aero-fX
• sportbacks get Terrain Mgmt, also all 3 have a separately opening rear window in their powered, foot-activated hatches
• all models are equipped with DriveControl "by Lincoln";
and • adjusting height suspension • undercarriage airflow panels as well as grille shutters • Adaptive (turning) headlights • Adaptive Cruise Control • programmable driver/car interface • docking station for bring-along tech gizmos** • Intelligent (keyless) Access • Remote Start • Ambient Lighting • wiper/HL co-ordination • Heated Steering Wheel & seats • power/memory driver seat & side mirrors & • power slide/recline front passenger seat • automatic climate with rear vents • power doorlocks/windows all 1-touch up/down • side window shades (rear doors) • basic Head-Up display (speed/tach/E-mode?) • upholstery: alcantara with Leather bolsters & armrests; all 'natural' or black/silver

((questions:
Push Button Start?
Electronic Parking Brake?
heated & heated/cooled seats by region?))
((Push Button Shift NOT included: Lincoln-only
also NO MyMercTouch**))


paint (6 colors)
silverIce.-------Steel.---------blackPearl
uraniumRed-...copperIce----Stealth(dk.coolgray)


standalone options:
XL moonroof Opt______($750?)
((w/ fixed glass rear roof-panel?))

Leather Opt___________($750?)
seat surfaces & panel inserts ((& trimming?))
Adobe (reddish tan)
Parchment (offwhite)
Ebony (with paint co-ordinated piping or accents?)


packages:
tech1 pkg____________($2000?)
• full (configurable!) Head-Up display • Rear View Camera • Auto Headlites & Highbeams • Rain-Sensing Wipers • Blind Spot Information System w/Cross Traffic Alert • sound system 2 (w/ noise cancelling?) • power rear window shade • full power front passenger seat (+Tilt/Ht/Lumbar/Headrest)
((cooled seats?))
additional paint: ultraBlue & whitePearl (8 colors)


tech2 pkg ___________($4000? SPecialOrder only)
techPlus_____________($5500? inclds Leather & moonroof)
• 'nightvision' • surround cameras • Active Park Assist with Forward&Rear Sensing System • Lane Keeping System • sound system 3 • Multi-Contour Front Seats with Active Motion™?
• auto-fold power rear headrests?
((Navigation?))
additional paint: Patina & ForeverGreen (10 colors)



Imho it's very important to have as few 'from-the-factory' versions as possible.
The idea for features is that everything 'you' can't live without is Standard
and the packages add 2 levels of "wants/wishes".
Since none of these Mercury vehicles are duplicated by Lincoln (or Ford) the highest package, 'techPlus' must include EVERYthing 'you' desire - let me know if I forgot anything.

some background:
Mission: MERCURY!
new 'Heresy'/Riddle

edit/& a new crossreference:
PTK94's "Mercury to Return Later...yes or no?"



Jan 2016: re-attached original pricing chart &
see Link for attached colors & updates
 

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Mercury is NEVER coming back....and for good reasons.


You guys kill me with this.
While I agree that I don't think Mercury will come back, you dont need to post stuff like this.


@2b2 I noticed that your Cougar is FWD based... are you sure you want another FWD based Cougar? A lot argue that the last gen Cougar was a sin upon the brand :D
 

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I agree with Andrew, I don't think Mercury has a chance, but what if...........

Ford could use it as a trim level for top of the line models with lux features above Titanium? While a "Mercury" trim level doesn't exactly role off the tongue maybe use "XR7" instead?
 

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Is Buick a success at GM to justify needing Mercury? Bringing Mercury back could allow Lincoln to reach higher again and be the bridge between Ford and Lincoln as the original plan back in 1939. But this time around no Lincoln-Mercury Division. Each is separate. I still like the Merkur name....has a more euro ring to it. But then, Merkur was as successful as the Edsel and PAG.

Why no Comet, Meteor or Monarch?

What are the target vehicles for this New Mercury Brand?
 

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I'm pretty sure Mercury is never coming back, with what it cost to shut down it wouldn't make sense to bring back. I still would like to see a Cougar made sold in the Lincoln brand as a special edition vehicle in limited numbers, no Lincoln badge again im sure it wont happen, especially since Americans have ruined the COUGAR name in pop culture.I could only imagine the ridicule of a 50 year old woman with a 20 year old male in the car but I digress.

Ford needs to focus on bringing back the Thunderbird if even as a 4 door RWD car. I dont understand how that nameplate went away.
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #9
While I agree that I don't think Mercury will come back...
I agree with Andrew, I don't think Mercury has a chance, but what if...........
Exactly
the premise of the thread is HOW could Merc come back.
Negatoids, Muggles, or those hung up on IF?, Why? & Should? just won't have anything worthwhile to contribute
because they haven't done the homework to pass that "intro course" yet (see Mission:Mercury)(or maybe the Heresy/Riddle thread could serve as a form of remedial Summer School?
)

Looking to recruit upper-class scholars (double meaning intended) to examine the proposal;
also critique & improve its methods & details!!



@2b2 I noticed that your Cougar is FWD based... are you sure you want another FWD based Cougar? A lot argue that the last gen Cougar was a sin upon the brand :D
Why no Comet, Meteor or Monarch?
Nope
I started to leave out the Cougar name & almost did. Feel free to white-out all names or suggest others.
Even tho the CD-platform models DO have a chance of being Rwd *or* Fwd, actually ALL these vehicles are AWD - really MORE than any Haldex-equipped one (which only activates at a loss of primary traction - these are intended to be propelled by every wheel even when conditions are ideal) ...which I did touch on ... there will be a QUIZ!
Bringing back heritage model Names is not the point. Even the Mercury Name is secondary to reviving the spirit/character/DNA (see Mission:Mercury) which no other Brand in the world possesses.

so
Ford could use it as a trim level for top of the line models with lux features above ? While a "Mercury" trim level doesn't exactly role off the tongue maybe use "XR7" instead?
Nope
not in N.A. ...perhaps in a few global markets? esp as small LINCOLNS;
a 'Ford' will never be a Mercury. They just don't have "it" in them. (red hair IS a recessive gene) Titanium proves this imho (a Muggle imitation that loses most of the transmutating-iosis alchemy/magic).


Maybe the "initial conditions" for the development of this proposal could help?
in no particular order
• Mercurys as sportING vehicles (a broader term than 'performance')
• Luxury that's not overt or in-your-face ...yet:
• features that are more 'generously' offered - as opposed to Lincoln's (Z) trim upon trims plus packages plus options that basically say you CAN'T have it 'your way' (a Fordish trait)
• the Small Mercs Theorem, ie smaller than Lincolns (no matter how the offices are arranged, Mercs by-&-large Will be sold With Lincolns)&(ARE related to Lincoln, Fords are more distant cousins)
• there ARE things both Lincoln & Ford just aren't suited to (ex/imho: "magicians")
• no bespoke platforms, All bespoke tophats
• an informal compilation of models/variants that have been asked/ranted for on various forums that, so far, show no sign of EVER being available
^these^
provided the framework and the niches-to-be-filled.

After each vehicle's basic specifications were created,
*while* the descriptions were being written;
the existing global vehicles that are not offered in N.A. just started "falling" into the waiting slots (Even pointing at profligate hair-splitting segmentation where 2 or MORE existing models could be merged into one - imho).

...Bringing Mercury back could allow Lincoln to reach higher again and be the bridge between Ford and Lincoln as the original plan back in 1939...

...What are the target vehicles for this New Mercury Brand?
now ^that^ is a worthwhile question, TurboS40, you go to head of the class

hopefully what I just typed provides some clues?
&
you guys tell me which vehicles hit which targets the best
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #10
I'm pretty sure Mercury is never coming back, with what it cost to shut down it wouldn't make sense to bring back. I still would like to see a Cougar made sold in the Lincoln brand as a special edition vehicle in limited numbers, no Lincoln badge again im sure it wont happen, especially since Americans have ruined the COUGAR name in pop culture.I could only imagine the ridicule of a 50 year old woman with a 20 year old male in the car but I digress.

Ford needs to focus on bringing back the Thunderbird if even as a 4 door RWD car. I dont understand how that nameplate went away.
hey, saintl1, THANKS for stopping by!


re: Thunderbird, you might check out the CD4+r.w.d. Poll thread for a FalconThunderTaurusBird idea
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #12
...Ford could use it as a trim level for top of the line models with lux features above Titanium? While a "Mercury" trim level doesn't exactly role off the tongue maybe use "XR7" instead?
actually
I *did* start wondering about using
XR5 for the C5/Cougar - or it's top trim designation AND
XR3 for the C3/Capri
plus
having a Fiesta-based 2-seater as the XR1...Miata-like but more power
&
someday maybe having a larger XR7 or XR9 even - depending on IF Lincoln gets its better-than-CLS RoadJet act together or not


Should we use the last Mercury logo or a historic one?...
There you are, N.R.
hoping to hear Much more from you (still thinking about a Continental proposal?)
&
I first had the antique logo from my sig in the first post
and only changed it cuz that's STILL in my sig

+ there are other logo ideas in Mission:Mercury
& at this point, it's almost a point of honor for me not to change the last logo 'too much' ...just yet
Can always add new ideas for one as this thread (hopefully) progresses



edit/addition
just to mention why I posted this now, seeing that 2020 is a ways off
BUT
thinking that 2020 models need to start their intros at/by the 2018 LAIAS
& 5½ years is barely enough imho to get everything going
 

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There you are, N.R. :joyous: hoping to hear Much more from you (still thinking about a Continental proposal?)
&
I first had the antique logo from my sig in the first post
and only changed it cuz that's STILL in my sig

+ there are other logo ideas in Mission:Mercury
& at this point, it's almost a point of honor for me not to change the last logo 'too much' ...just yet
Can always add new ideas for one as this thread (hopefully) progresses



edit/addition
just to mention why I posted this now, seeing that 2020 is a ways off
BUT
thinking that 2020 models need to start their intros at/by the 2018 LAIAS
& 5½ years is barely enough imho to get everything going
It depends on how frustrated I get with Lincoln. :banghead: I really want Lincoln to move further more(way more!) upscale so we can see Mercury again.

As for the logo, yes I do love the one from your sig.
 

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I want Mercury to be a blend of premium and performance(sorta like pre 60s Buick and Merkur combined).

Here's my line-up(? not sure about names on some of them; &=variants).

Note: Mercury should not have SUVs, imo.

Cars

?- urban car
?- compact FWD/AWD sedan
?&- compact RWD sport sedan
Cougar&- RWD compact coupe' and convertible
Messenger?- RWD personal car
Milan- Midsize FWD/AWD sedan
Scorpio&- midsized RWD sport sedan
Sable?- Large FWD/AWD sedan
Marauder or S-55?&- large RWD sport sedan
Park Lane&- large RWD premium sedan

CUVs

Mariner- Compact CUV
*- Midsize CUV
*- Large SUV
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #15
As for the logo, yes I do love the one from your sig.
was from 1939-1940 according to the source (which I don't remember)

2b2 said:
(still thinking about a Continental proposal?)
It depends on how frustrated I get with Lincoln. :banghead: I really want Lincoln to move further more(way more!) upscale so we can see Mercury again.
Oh! let me join you


imho this is one of the neat things about keeping THE RETURN in accordance with the Small Merc Theorem...
(can always strip Lincoln of everything but the Navi and TownCar replacement
turning the MK-whatevers into Mercs + going above Lincoln with your Continental Series
then simply let Lincoln die out because they're just too big for their food(customer)sources - my "Dinosaur Extinction Strategem")​
...AT FIRST... while we plot world domination
muahahahahahaha


&
names are tricky
imho for product planning it might be better to wait until they're ready for marketing?

re-arranging
F-Awd Cars

Sable?- Large FWD/AWD sedan patience grasshopper
Milan = Midsize FWD/AWD sedan
Cortina = compact FWD/AWD sedan
Micro = urban car

Rwd Cars
for new names just starting to ponder using various GOD names...
Park Lane&- large RWD premium sedan
XR9? = Marauder or S-55?&- large RWD sport sedan
Scorpio&- midsized RWD sport sedan
XR7? = Messenger?- RWD personal car
toptrim C5/Cougar = RWD compact coupe' and convertible
?&- compact RWD sport sedan...recently read about how smaller Rwd's lack the room for sedan-use, relegating them mostly to sportcoupes; just 'reporting' that

CUVs

miniSport = Mariner- Compact CUV
metaSport = *- Midsize CUV
*- Large SUV



And...
anyone ready to talk about features & prices yet?
where's LincolnFanFl ...& Iiari?
:toetap:
 

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FIN Moderator
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was from 1939-1940 according to the source (which I don't remember)


Oh! let me join you


imho this is one of the neat things about keeping THE RETURN in accordance with the Small Merc Theorem...
(can always strip Lincoln of everything but the Navi and TownCar replacement
turning the MK-whatevers into Mercs + going above Lincoln with your Continental Series
then simply let Lincoln die out because they're just too big for their food(customer)sources - my "Dinosaur Extinction Strategem")​
...AT FIRST... while we plot world domination
muahahahahahaha


&
names are tricky
imho for product planning it might be better to wait until they're ready for marketing?

re-arranging
F-Awd Cars

Sable?- Large FWD/AWD sedan patience grasshopper
Milan = Midsize FWD/AWD sedan
Cortina = compact FWD/AWD sedan
Micro = urban car

Rwd Cars
for new names just starting to ponder using various GOD names...
Park Lane&- large RWD premium sedan
XR9? = Marauder or S-55?&- large RWD sport sedan
Scorpio&- midsized RWD sport sedan
XR7? = Messenger?- RWD personal car
toptrim C5/Cougar = RWD compact coupe' and convertible
?&- compact RWD sport sedan...recently read about how smaller Rwd's lack the room for sedan-use, relegating them mostly to sportcoupes; just 'reporting' that

CUVs

miniSport = Mariner- Compact CUV
metaSport = *- Midsize CUV
*- Large SUV



And...
anyone ready to talk about features & prices yet?
where's LincolnFanFl ...& Iiari?
:toetap:
I really do hope the MK-Series goes so Lincoln can be an upscale company/brand. Let Mercury handle the lower-end.

Ugh, someone else is already planning world domination, silly.


Did you like the Merkur XR4Ti name? Maybe Mercury's nomenclature could be based off that.
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #17
^so.......
Are you ok with the small(er)-only part for the BEGINNING of The Return, N.R.?


...Let Mercury handle the lower-end.

Ugh, someone else is already planning world domination, silly.


Did you like Merkur XR4Ti name? Maybe Mercury's nomenclature could be based off that.
• "lower end" is one reason I'm curious about reactions to features & pricing
(a main other is my re-arrangement of the Z's optioning)
since I tried to include just about everything the new Z currently offers - on Every model of course
Compare the new Milan's $34-41k to the "first edition" of the new Z
(tho I really am expecting pricing of $40k & up for the Lincoln in the near (Nano) future ... and many more features? dunno what)

• *automotive* world domination?
Oh, do you mean VW
?

• re: XR4Ti, not at the time - was still in feline mode
tho I can see some similarities to "C3-XR" & "C5-XR"
actually
(tho it'd prolley be confusing / bad marketing)
I wonder if each drivetrain-type could have a different significator
like:
C3/Coupe3/H3 for the Hybrid
Capri for the 'M'
XR3 for the performance version
?

&
re: the C5
_wlb___ovl____w____h____
108.0 - 177.0 - 77.0 - 53.0 - Evos Concept
110.2 - 182.0 - 75.0 - 54.0 - 2020 C5-Cougar
106.4 - 185.0 - 69.6 - 52.2 - 1999 Cougar
111.4 - 190.3 - 71.2 - 51.8 - 1967 Cougar
The C5-Cougar, tho drawing inspiration from the Evos Concept, would actually be 'near' the size of of the last, Fwd Cougar ... tho a very different car with a significantly longer wheelbase and MUCH wider

edit - wanted to include the MC4 Concept's dimensions but can't find them



eye candy ^ in lieu of chops
 

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Mercury could restart with the Start. Remember the concept from a couple years ago.
Mercury could initially compete against the Mini and Fiat brands. A standard, and a 'performance' version of the Start. After that, a pint sized CUV and a performance coupe would be good additiions for the 2nd and 3rd year.
Keep the dealerships small, and far apart.
They also need a marketing phenomenom to pull it off
 

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^so.......
Are you ok with the small(er)-only part for the BEGINNING of The Return, N.R.?



• "lower end" is one reason I'm curious about reactions to features & pricing
(a main other is my re-arrangement of the Z's optioning)
since I tried to include just about everything the new Z currently offers - on Every model of course
Compare the new Milan's $34-41k to the "first edition" of the new Z
(tho I really am expecting pricing of $40k & up for the Lincoln in the near (Nano) future ... and many more features? dunno what)

• *automotive* world domination?
Oh, do you mean VW
?

• re: XR4Ti, not at the time - was still in feline mode
tho I can see some similarities to "C3-XR" & "C5-XR"
actually
(tho it'd prolley be confusing / bad marketing)
I wonder if each drivetrain-type could have a different significator
like:
C3/Coupe3/H3 for the Hybrid
Capri for the 'M'
XR3 for the performance version
?

&
re: the C5
_wlb___ovl____w____h____
108.0 - 177.0 - 77.0 - 53.0 - Evos Concept
110.2 - 182.0 - 75.0 - 54.0 - 2020 C5-Cougar
106.4 - 185.0 - 69.6 - 52.2 - 1999 Cougar
111.4 - 190.3 - 71.2 - 51.8 - 1967 Cougar
The C5-Cougar, tho drawing inspiration from the Evos Concept, would actually be 'near' the size of of the last, Fwd Cougar ... tho a very different car with a significantly longer wheelbase and MUCH wider

edit - wanted to include the MC4 Concept's dimensions but can't find them



eye candy ^ in lieu of chops
Sure, like Logans Run said, I would start off with a Start/Ka.

Mercury would basically take Lincoln's pricing since Lincoln will be moving more upscale(hopefully!).

VW is really planning it. Now, they're taking it more slowly, but I do still see them acquiring Navistar in the near future.

I really like the MC4. I wish they would've built it(I also really love the Marque X Concept in the background).
 

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Mercury C557
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Discussion Starter #20
^ Logan & N.R.,
tho I really liked the Start Concept
I've got maybe 4 reasons to not *begin* with that
QUOTE Mercurys as sportING vehicles (a broader term than 'performance')...
...belated thanks to Syr for this perspective

• the B-segment (Micro / microSport) is close enough for round-one imho
• I want to see enough vehicles to re-establish the Mercury "channel" - with a continuum leading up to the Lincoln models - so launching sales with at least 5-6 models
• we have no idea what (or maybe even IF) a new KA will be

perhaps in certain global markets a MercKA would work? (tho maybe not WESTERN Europe)&(but then I'd prolley really want an XR1 to "go with" it)...after something more aspirational made the Brand's First Impression;
that's why I'm thinking of intro'ing the C3 & C5 at LAIAS2018
or C3 + microSport LAIAS2018 and C5 + miniSport at NAIAS2019
with On-Sale to co-incide with the Chicago Autoshow in Feb2019
(leaving NYC mostly for Lincoln intros)
((also
maybe a pre-LAIAS-tease at Moscow &or Paris 2018...
...Hybrids at WashingtonDC early-Feb2019...
...the euro-lineup at Geneva 2019...
...and full lineup at BeiJing end-April2019...))
 
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