Ford Inside News banner

1 - 20 of 37 Posts

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
7,893 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
New Audi A3 vs Ford Escort Concept


According to carscoops.com, following last year's announcement on the starting MSRP for the new 2014 Audi A3 sedan, Audi disclosed full pricing today for the two launch models of the series in the United States.



The base MSRP for the front-wheel drive 170hp A3 1.8 TFSI will start at $29,900 and the 220hp 2.0 TFSI, at $32,900, not including an $895 destination and handling fee for either model.

Which begs the question.....Could it be that Ford is closer to a Lincoln entry-luxury sedan than most expect? With the A3 being based on the (larger than Focus sedan) compact Jetta sedan, Ford may have unveiled their larger compact platform with the Escort Concept.



The Escort Concept may be designed(obvious design queues from Ford and Lincoln) to meet the needs of a lower price compact consumer in China, but the slightly larger(more room in back seat) c-segment platform could also be a perfect fit for a Lincoln FWD/AWD entry luxury compact sedan.

And when you take a minute to look at how the design lines match between the Escort Concept and the MKC Concept, the intentions of Ford/Lincoln seem to be come even more clear.



But looking at the A3 specifications, the a base Lincoln with a 1.5L EcoBoost(meets displacement restrictions and avoids fees in China) engine at 181hp and 185 torque and the upgrade to the 2.0L EcoBoost at 275hp and 300 lb-ft torque would lead in power. Intelligent AWD, available on the MKC which shares the same platform, is already available.

With the One Ford plan in place, it's clear that Ford does not make too many one off vehicles. And with the compact entry-luxury market growing rapidly, and is expected to continue strong growth over years to come globally, along with Lincoln's focus on high volume models, it may be that a Focus/Escort Concept based compact entry-luxury sedan may launch before a Mustang based RWD performance sedan.

Which makes more sense for Lincoln, since it is easier to get into a market early while it's growing, than it is to fight it's way into a new market with well established leaders. Essentially climbing up the the luxury segments with brand new models, gaining new younger customers along the way.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,470 Posts
more than the escort I think it would be great to see a MKA sedan and hatchback from Lincoln to compete with the A3/A class-CLA class/1 series-2 series
 

·
Mercury C557
Joined
·
22,734 Posts
Bloggin said:
...Could it be that Ford is closer to a Lincoln entry-luxury sedan than most expect?...

...it may be that a Focus/Escort Concept based compact entry-luxury sedan may launch before a Mustang based RWD performance sedan...
naturally**, I'd prefer my MKE.
Parlty because I feel Lincoln would do well to stay no smaller than a 3-series-sized sportsedan (the BMW 3 is bigger than many think = not your grandfather's 3er!)
except
for a specialty electricy model ...even a 3/sportsedan could be considered 'specialty'.
AND I'd really like to see Lincoln reclaim their part in the S-class segment - which will probably take several iterations to gain acceptance

plus**
imho it'd be better for my Brand to return via the small-Mercs-theory in mainly a "bakers'-C-segment"... from a bit-smaller-than to a bit-bigger-than
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,470 Posts
naturally**, I'd prefer my MKE.
Parlty because I feel Lincoln would do well to stay no smaller than a 3-series-sized sportsedan (the BMW 3 is bigger than many think = not your grandfather's 3er!)
except
for a specialty electricy model ...even a 3/sportsedan could be considered 'specialty'.
AND I'd really like to see Lincoln reclaim their part in the S-class segment - which will probably take several iterations to gain acceptance

plus**
imho it'd be better for my Brand to return via the small-Mercs-theory in mainly a "bakers'-C-segment"... from a bit-smaller-than to a bit-bigger-than
I would like to see a Lincoln to compete with the S class-7 series-A8 but I think before it they need a RWD sedan and a coupe to compete with the 3 series and a compact car like the CLA
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
7,893 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
more than the escort I think it would be great to see a MKA sedan and hatchback from Lincoln to compete with the A3/A class-CLA class/1 series-2 series
The Escort Concept is the size of the A3 and CLA. That's what the article is about. The Escort 'Concept' being the base vehicle for a Lincoln compact sedan(along with being the base for a Ford compact for China). Essentially a sibling to the MKC. Both being smaller than a 3-Series RWD competitor.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
7,893 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
naturally**, I'd prefer my MKE.
Parlty because I feel Lincoln would do well to stay no smaller than a 3-series-sized sportsedan (the BMW 3 is bigger than many think = not your grandfather's 3er!)
except
for a specialty electricy model ...even a 3/sportsedan could be considered 'specialty'.
AND I'd really like to see Lincoln reclaim their part in the S-class segment - which will probably take several iterations to gain acceptance

plus**
imho it'd be better for my Brand to return via the small-Mercs-theory in mainly a "bakers'-C-segment"... from a bit-smaller-than to a bit-bigger-than
I see what you mean, but with the entry compact luxury market gaining momentum, it's the best place for Lincoln to be to gain entry market consumers for the brand globally. And it looks like Ford is well into the design of the sedan for the Ford brand based on the Escort Concept, which means very soon we will see the Lincoln entry luxury model. The sooner the better for Lincoln.
 

·
Mercury C557
Joined
·
22,734 Posts
edit cuz i didn't see your post while I waws posting
^THAT^ sounds like short-term thinking, no offense
besides
the Escort is C1-based = the PREVIOUS generation = 2004½ technology



[ once again ]

imho MB is identified with/by the S-class while BMW is by the 3-series
therefore-imho
FOR LUXURY, MB automatically wins

taking my favorite adjective form of
= "Lincolnesque"
that doesn't sound compact at all to me
&
unless they get the lineup above the MKZ working/selling/making people drool,
imho it'd be the start of a Death Of A Thousand Cuts
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,401 Posts
My first thought was no way they can put a smaller car under the MKZ given the $36k starting price. But then I look and Mercedes C-Class starts at $36k and the CLA sits at $30k.

If Lincoln ever were to try to join the very entry level premium segment I would prefer to see them go the Integra route. Something exciting that the younger generation would latch onto rather than an A3 like sedan. While the A3 is nice in a sort of A4 little brother kind of way it doesn't excite. When I try to picture a LincFocus what I keep envisioning is the Buick Verano and that isn't gonna fly. The other idea I like is a shooting brake body style, but then that would end up looking a lot like a lowered MKC and would likely take sales from it too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,042 Posts
Very interesting thread! I think that the Escort name has slightly tainted out impression of this car... if it had been called anything else, I don't think that it would seem like such a stretch as a Lincoln, as leats looks wise. It is a very clean, slick design. I actaully see it along the lines of a Verano, an anassuming but attractive small midluxury design. I don't think that it would take much to kick the glamour up a notch or two for it to be a true proper Lincoln.

That said, I know nothing about the origins or dynamics of the car, and if it could easily be equipped with Lincoln technology, but from a pure esthetics standpoint, it's a great starting point, I think.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,693 Posts
Very interesting thread! I think that the Escort name has slightly tainted out impression of this car... if it had been called anything else, I don't think that it would seem like such a stretch as a Lincoln, as leats looks wise. It is a very clean, slick design. I actaully see it along the lines of a Verano, an anassuming but attractive small midluxury design. I don't think that it would take much to kick the glamour up a notch or two for it to be a true proper Lincoln.

That said, I know nothing about the origins or dynamics of the car, and if it could easily be equipped with Lincoln technology, but from a pure esthetics standpoint, it's a great starting point, I think.

The Escort is based on a Mk2 Focus (C1-platform) which happens to be my daily driver, it's a pretty good handling car. The Global Mk3 Focus's Global C platform was derived from the Mk2's C1-platform.
Mk2 Focus (facelifted 5-door model shown)


If you're going to make a small Lincoln, starting off with a previous generation platform is not the right direction.
If they made a short wheelbase version of the new MKZ-Fusion's CD4 platform (which includes Ford's new generation multi-link suspension), now that would be more interesting for a compact Lincoln.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,042 Posts
If you're going to make a small Lincoln, starting off with a previous generation platform is not the right direction.
If they made a short wheelbase version of the new MKZ-Fusion's CD4 platform (which includes Ford's new generation multi-link suspension), now that would be more interesting for a compact Lincoln.
Agreed. Would the current (MK3) platform not be a good starting point? Is a new one out soon?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,013 Posts
The compact luxury car segment is growning very fast (mercedes CLA, Audi A3 sedan, BMW 1 series) Almost at the compact crossover pace... Lincoln is already in the compact crossover with the MK C. I think the next step is introduce a compact luxury sedan. This car could be made on a extended Focus platform. The Escort is based on previous gen Focus, so, is not the rigth choice. The big problem for Lincoln is the price. They must put this car in a band price (27K-35k $) that could include the Focus Titanium and some base Fusions, even, some base MK Zs. That is a problem. But if Lincoln make a very distintive car, with all the tech gizmos , could atract young buyers to their dealers. I think the style and design are determinants in the succes of this car.

And, please, forget that horrible thing picture above.. that compact concept deserve to die and be forgotten.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,042 Posts
And, please, forget that horrible thing picture above.. that compact concept deserve to die and be forgotten.
Not a fan of the Concept C I see!!! I find it very original and distinctive, a real classy stand-out in a class of look-alikes. Those fender curves are like nothing else out there. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I'd love to see Lincoln build something off-the-wall like that!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,799 Posts
Why base a Lincoln on the cheap developing-world Escort and not the Focus?

The big problem with Lincoln is that it's not a sporting brand and that's how most of these small cars are sold by successful luxury brands. Customers in the market for such a car are never going to be interested in Lincoln. This is perhaps Lincoln's biggest and possibly fatal flaw, young customers entering the market for sporting and hip entry-level luxury cars. It's by far the biggest growing segment and Lincoln is not culturally equipped to address it and Ford brand can't either. They are going to miss it entirely unless Lincoln suddenly changes direction, and if you want to invest in your future customers you have to start with them young. This is where I develop extreme doubt in Lincoln's long-term prospects.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,470 Posts
Why base a Lincoln on the cheap developing-world Escort and not the Focus?

The big problem with Lincoln is that it's not a sporting brand and that's how most of these small cars are sold by successful luxury brands. Customers in the market for such a car are never going to be interested in Lincoln. This is perhaps Lincoln's biggest and possibly fatal flaw, young customers entering the market for sporting and hip entry-level luxury cars. It's by far the biggest growing segment and Lincoln is not culturally equipped to address it and Ford brand can't either. They are going to miss it entirely unless Lincoln suddenly changes direction, and if you want to invest in your future customers you have to start with them young. This is where I develop extreme doubt in Lincoln's long-term prospects.
agree, the entry level escort won´t be a great base for a luxury car..........they could use the focus, IMHO they have to do something like the A class-Cla from MB
 

·
Mercury C557
Joined
·
22,734 Posts
paul8488 said:
And simply because I haven't seen it mentioned here in ages:
[verboten bilde]
tv/movie-quote references:

StarTrek TNG - Lt.Worf - re: the different appearance of Klingons from the original series
"We do not speak of it"

1st Harry Potter - Olivander - re: Voldemort
"We do not speak his name"

Dune - BeneGesserit ReverendMother - re: the Kwisatz Haderach
"ABOMINATION!"


BORG said:
The big problem with Lincoln is that it's not a sporting brand and that's how most of these small cars are sold by successful luxury brands. Customers in the market for sus entering the market for sporting and hip entry-level luxury cars. It's by far the biggest growing segment and Lincoln is not culturally ch a car are never going to be interested in Lincoln. This is perhaps Lincoln's biggest and possibly fatal flaw, young customerequipped to address it and Ford brand can't either. They are going to miss it entirely unless Lincoln suddenly changes direction, and if you want to invest in your future customers you have to start with them young. This is where I develop extreme doubt in Lincoln's long-term prospects.
MERCURY: the FUN side of Luxury!


falcon lover said:
...The big problem for Lincoln is the price. They must put this car in a band price (27K-35k $)...
just imho
Lincoln needs to do everything it can to get its least expensive model/trim up to $39,999
ASAP

falcon lover said:
...I think the next step is introduce a compact luxury sedan. This car could be made on a extended Focus platform...
...if Lincoln make a very distintive car..
again-imho
the GRAND C-Max variant, long-wheelbase-C3, already exists
ergo: my MKE


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

the thing I wonder about, with the extreme-imho emphasis on 'family" Cuvs & sedans, is:
What about the 50%++ divorce rate??
Shouldn't some mfg be demographing the single-parent consumer?
or
those putting-off/avoiding traditional marriage? (with presumably more disposable income)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
997 Posts
Why not a Lincoln exclusive platform for now then filter down as a Ford to use? It's easier to say the Lincoln-based Ford "whatever name" rather than the Ford-based Lincoln MK something.

So it looks like this Escort Concept could be the basis of a Lincoln in China only?
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
7,893 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
The Escort is based on a Mk2 Focus (C1-platform) which happens to be my daily driver, it's a pretty good handling car. The Global Mk3 Focus's Global C platform was derived from the Mk2's C1-platform.
Mk2 Focus (facelifted 5-door model shown)


If you're going to make a small Lincoln, starting off with a previous generation platform is not the right direction.
If they made a short wheelbase version of the new MKZ-Fusion's CD4 platform (which includes Ford's new generation multi-link suspension), now that would be more interesting for a compact Lincoln.
Where are you finding the data that shows the Escort Concept is using the older Mk2 or Focus Classic 10 year old platform, and not the current gen Focus platform that all current global Ford/Lincoln C-Segment vehicles are riding on? The only data I can find is that this Escort concept will replace the current Focus Classic.

With Ford's One Ford plan and intent to limit the number of platforms, it would seem illogical for Ford to launch a 'new' vehicle using an old platform. It's more cost effective for the Escort Concept to ride on the current C platform as the current Focus/Escape/C-MAX/MKC, etc.
 
1 - 20 of 37 Posts
Top