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I feared the front end, but the more I look, the more I like. I take it back. This is much better than outgoing. I love the front and the back.



And it is ohhh so much better looking than the 3 of 3 platform shared GM version....which now looks ugly too me.




And asking around, the V6 will be quite a bit more than the advertised 370/430. My guess, 375/445. All while improving efficiency, which some here seem to condemn in Ford and praise elsewhere.

Nice job Lincoln. You delivered a solid interim product, while simultaneously preparing a revolutionary product. Something I see little of from the competition.
 

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The Escalade looks quite nice for an Escalade, the Navigator fascia isn't bad at all IMO, but the body is just way too outdated compared to the Escalade. Not surprisingly (if you're a Lincoln customer), the interior on the Lincoln appears far more posh than the Escalade.

GM still treats the Escalade with low priority, clearly they don't care that it's just a truck. The Escalade represents many things I hate about old Detroit luxury, which is a low-tech superficial affair that relies more on appearances than substance. The Navigator, despite its ancient exterior and lack of modern ammenities, is still based on a bespoke platform and suspension system that you can't find on any pickup. And for that reason, I would almost certainly choose the Navigator over the Escalade.

Nevermind the fact that the Navigator is now over $12K cheaper than the Escalade. Certainly Caddy will make a ton more money and that brand is worth allot more, but Lincoln at least has a customer niche to fill.

In the end, Lincoln is far from finished and it still needs Ford to get its act together on a new Expy. The end result may be worth the wait, certainly if the F-150 is any indication. It takes longer to do better, especially in a segment that Ford just barely exited. I know we've had a similar kvetching storm like this before Ford turned its act around.

And btw, the Navigator chassis has far more in common with a Land Rover or GL than the Escalade.
 

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And one more comment on FE, which one member can't seem to condemn enough.

Please tell me exactly, which part of our brain that craves more luxury, prestige, features, style, etc. and that allows us to pay a $8-10K premium over Expedition......suddenly eliminates all concern with fuel economy and filling our tanks more frequently?

Exactly.
 

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After the spy pics went around a while ago, I wasn't expecting much of a change in the first place. To me it seems like a very lazy refresh. It's no secret that I HATE the current (3rd gen) Navigator. This 4th gen, doesn't look as bad. I did however expect major changes on the interior though. I read on this blog and a couple of others that the interior was really going to improve. Well, obviously that didn't happen for whatever reason. I doesn't look as good but it still doesn't look good. I can't tell the quality of materials used from the pics but it does look like there is quite a bit of cheap plastic in there. And those air vents look like they're Ford Tempo surplus or something. HOPEFULLY this will hold Lincoln over until they can do a clean sheet, all new one when the next Expedition comes out. Lincoln DESPERATELY needs that if they're still going to keep the Navigator going in the future. Also, does anyone out there know why they're still calling it a Navigator? It seems to me that with this refresh, it would have been a good time to change the name to MKN or MK???

No. That Lincoln keeps the Navigator name is one of the better things of this refresh. No MK something name, please.

Back in topic and jokes for Geermezy1 aside, this refresh is a good job. I like a lot this truck. Is the better they could do with this squared box. The front and the rear end looks very nice and modern. And i think this SUV is superior to a Cadillac Escalade. The reason: 3 letters: IRS. The "New" Escalade still have a dinosaurios era solid rear axle... The Navigator have IRS. Of course, the ride is better with IRS.

About the V8, who care how many cil are in the engine bay, when the truck is more powerful with the new engine and, plus, more fuel efficient?. I had a 2007 V8 Explorer and now i drive a 2012 V6 Explorer. I dont miss the 8 cil .
 

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Nah, the greenhouse has more problems than just being boxy. The windows are too low which is a design holdover from the original 1997 truck. The glass isn't flush and surrounded by lots trim, again a symptom of outdated design which creates the impression of low-quality. New design brings better quality and tolerances, you can't carry it over this long without falling behind the industry standards.
 

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Sorry guys but I agree with germeeze although the engine is the least of its problems. Ecoboost is a great power plant and it will have no problem moving this thing.

My problem is that this is such a mediocre job! I mean a person from another planet would not believe that Lincoln is affiliated with Ford, the brand that everyone is calling the Apple of the automotive industry. Autoblog says that the interior is a combination of leather, wood, and TONS of plastic! In a segment like this that's not acceptable. Like it was said, why a person that is looking to buy a vehicle in this segment opt for the Navi when you have Escalade, Range Rover, GL, and even the Infiniti QX? I'm sorry but I just don't see it.

Pluses? Well theres the ecoboost engine, the wheels are very nice, the parts that are leather and wood are high quality, and I hope that the price is much lower than the competition.

I hope this is a year only refresh I really do.
This is a refresh... not a redone. And this is a refresh for 2 years, not 1. Why spent a lot of money changing the interior for only 2 years? The next Navigator will solve all that problems... and you will be happy. Ok... not all of you... some ones here will hate it whatever Lincoln will do with it.
 

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How well do the SWB models sell as compared to the LWB ones in both the Escalade and Navigator? I maybe wrong, but what's the point of the SWB? I would rather see them replaced by a decked out FWD/AWD CUV and leave the LWB models as the flagships of the fleets.

As for the EBV6 vs. the V8 debate, the T3.5L is a great engine and is the right choice for the entry models but I'd like to see the Mustang's ~450HP 5.0L V8 with an 8 speed automatic as the plant for the top model. While silence is golden, the slightly muted rumble of a Ford V8 under the hood adds to the luxury of the vehicle. And they all must have dual exhaust. Navigators have had that weird-looking single exhaust with a round muffler/resonator hanging low out the back, which always looked tacked on and cheap.
 

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I feared the front end, but the more I look, the more I like. I take it back. This is much better than outgoing. I love the front and the back.



And it is ohhh so much better looking than the 3 of 3 platform shared GM version....which now looks ugly too me.




And asking around, the V6 will be quite a bit more than the advertised 370/430. My guess, 375/445. All while improving efficiency, which some here seem to condemn in Ford and praise elsewhere.

Nice job Lincoln. You delivered a solid interim product, while simultaneously preparing a revolutionary product. Something I see little of from the competition.
agree with you wings, the more I look it, more I like it.......also I don´t understand why the people said this is bad......come on does the new escalade have a better front??? I don´t think so.......does it have a better back??? you´ve got to be kidding me if you like those volvo wagon tail lights!
 

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I suspect sales will tell the tale. And it won't be the tale you just told.
And the Escalade will do it at much higher price point.
 

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I suspect sales will tell the tale. And it won't be the tale you just told.
Well the escalade have sold better the last year I guess that will remain like that.....I think is brand image or maybe for.someones that the escalade ia more powerful or more bling because as a SUV the NAvi is better with its IRS
 

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Discussion Starter #56
And the Escalade will do it at much higher price point.
I'd bet money Yukon has higher transaction prices than the Navigator. But yeah, Escalade will out-sell this at higher price points. That's basically guaranteed.

I think only offering the TTV6 is a mistake. These buyers like their V8's and don't care about the fuel economy (you're buying an $80K SUV, after all).
 

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I'd bet money Yukon has higher transaction prices than the Navigator. But yeah, Escalade will out-sell this at higher price points. That's basically guaranteed.

I think only offering the TTV6 is a mistake. These buyers like their V8's and don't care about the fuel economy (you're buying an $80K SUV, after all).
 

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The exterior is about what I expected, and it does look better. It is an admirable update for the basic shape and greenhouse they had to keep. Assuming this will be out in fall of this year, and be sold until fall of 2016, I'd give the exterior upgrade an 8.5 out of 10.

As for the interior...there are bright spots...but they are just reflections off the cheap plastic! What bothers me most, is what you will see everyday, right in front of you. That steering wheel just has to not make it to production. So, what does Lincoln really needs to do? I'd say, stop using premium materials with fancy names, just to mention them in marketing sound bits if you are applying them where they are surrounded by cheap plastic. There are still 2 and a half years until the new Navigator, and the interior on this update doesn't look good, six months before it is even released.
I expected more from Lincoln, and I am disappointed. I'd give the interior upgrade a 3 out of 10.

As for the engine/transmission, I think it was a great choice, and makes the update worthwhile. 10 out of 10.

Overall, a fair update.
 

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Nice Job Lincoln!

Well done refresh. The Navigator now looks like it belongs with the rest of the Lincoln lineup. A bigger, bolder interpretation of the MKC front end, while maintaining it's classic, elegant, understated luxury look and feel.

Lincoln has even managed a tighter/cleaner fit where the front/rear bumper panel meets the finders. And the new shorter chrome exhaust pipe fits better. Automatic lift gate was mentioned, which must mean it's now foot activated.

With electric power steering comes Active Park Assist, which could make the Navigator sale on it's own.

In the pictures, the dark color long L version no longer looks out of balance in the rear, but it is still 15 inches longer than the base model. Can't wait to see the base model in a darker color, or any other colors.

Cleaning up the details all around for a more smooth and lighter look worked out great. It has clearly lost weight, along with a lighter V6 as standard. The larger 20" wheels help with it's proportions also. It's a nice upgrade that the side plates that say Navigator are now painted aluminum to match the body instead of plastic, which goes with the aluminum hood and aluminum lift gate.

I like the leather wrapped and hand stitched dash and new steering wheel and super soft leather seats.

With the new Escalade moving it's base price from $64k to $72k, even if the base 2015 Navigator went from $56k to $60k, it would still start $12k less than an entry Escalade, and offers lots of room to load up on all options and still be below the Escalade entry price.

With Escalade moving up $8k, it essentially puts the Navigator is in it's own price class, which is a good thing for this refreshed model, while Lincoln readies the all new model for MY2017. Lincoln should say Thank You Cadillac!
 
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